I am confused how you wipe your profit out in one day. The bet is 9 points (1,3,5), therefore the liability is only ever 9 points. As long you stick to fixed stakes and betting bank for Melchior of 72 points which is what is recommend then you won't have any problems.

My experience is that the reason people fail with tipping services is for the following reasons:-

1) They think they are better than the system so start trying to be clever like only backing the selections given they think will win or adjusting the stakes based on their knowledge.
2) They adjust stakes based on winning or losing runs. The only way to do this properly is a percentage bank method. I personally use fixed stakes as it is easier for me.
3)They don't have the patience when a long losing run occurs.
4)They don't back the selections everyday.

I have been with one for example Brimardon for 3 years and every year it has made a profit. They have to have a maximum bet and lay on each race on every single race today and lose on every race to wipe out the bank in one day.

Isiris again had a bad run until recently but in last few weeks have done really well. To be honest I not really an advocate of tipping services because it requires a very focused mindset and most people don't have it and then start slagging off the services. The reality is they thought they could get rich quick, lacked the mental stregth, tried to beat the system and lost money. I have done the same myself. Fortunately I was able to accept it was my fault and not the system.

I don't want to be drawn into a big argument though. As the general opinion is that tipping services are for stupid people like me. I am happy to be stupid if it means that I make a very healthy yearly profit.

In addition I have created my own trading system so I am covered from both angles. Creating my own system has taken huge amount of effort but it is extremely rewarding.

i think you misunderstood me,i agree you should never think you are better than the system,and should always stake as suggested,my profits didnt get wiped out in a day,just over a period of loosers,with the system backing 2nd favourites you need the luck and judgement from the tipster to give you a good start as most 2nd fav,s dont have a good price,if yor winners are followed by a few loosers it does not take long staking 900 per day to loose your profit,i sll recomend the melchior,the system tries to build up dosh gradually,o quick fix methods.and like i said roy who runs the system is a great bloke,whos always available for advice

Eventually your bank will be wiped out, and your Roy will make lovely excuses. I'm not being rude, just telling you what is going to happen.

In horse racing, and I may get flamed for this, when you are doing back testing and fitting methods to historical data you are doing, whether knowingly or not, no more than making the assiumption that it is a random sequence that you are dealing with. Problem with dealing in random sequences is that, whether you like it or not, you are not at any advantage if you are clever or dumb, since the system is mechanical. Granted you will have periods of profitability and losses, but do you seriously think anyone would want to sustain the painful period?

My advice to you nunny, and you don't have to take it, is get the Hell out of the Melchoir system and spend your profits/money that you would have lost on something enjoyable - like a holiday. Same for the Brimardon system.

I am sure that Roy is a nice guy and also so are the people at Brimardon. But ask yourself:

1) why do they need your money? (I know this is stated to death but it needs to be stated again)
2) where are they making THEIR money from, if they don't mind my asking?

I could tell you a system now that will have 80 or more winning days IN A ROW with a staking plan similar to the Melchoir, and then there will be events that wipes out the bank and I'll have to rejig a few rules and sweet talk the clients telling them it will get better, hope it will, and start the process all over again, collecting my subscriptions to keep me going.

Oh, and isn't it strange how these tipsters/service providers are so nice and well mannered when it comes to parting you with your money, almost sycophantically so.

As I stated before certain tipsters are very good, most are bloody awful. But if you are hoping to become very wealthy relying on them forget it. Livermore's advice about not taking any tips should apply to horse racing as well.

My personal view is that you can be profitable on your own backing and laying horses but the work involved is horrendous, and it's not a really sustainable livelihood, which is why the professionals need subscribers. In short the risk/reward ratio is not great, trading is easier than horse racing, because the horse can f*ck up all your analysis work on a race by falling, having a bad day, being doped etc . . .

Me and a friend of mine were thinking of getting into horse racing professionally. We would get a flat/house, spend 10 - 14 hours a day analysing the races and use back/lay our selections, and literally have no life apart from this - I am deadly serious about this. We know we can be profitable because we've done it in the past in a less intense way, but the hours and the work involved is too great for little rewards that we get and the losing runs would just p*ss us off. When we did it we took over 5K from betfair in a period of 3 months, working on the racing after coming back from work. We could have scaled up to make about 3 times that before emotions crepted in, but then both he and I realised what it was that it was doing to us. We are both quite young, early thirties, and realised that doing this literally left us with virtually no leisure time - because that's what it takes!!!

I don't mean to be motivational or anything, but it is my belief that you can be profitable if you give this game the dedication and attention it deserves, but you might not like the price you have to pay for it. The last thing I would ever want to do is to rely on a tipster or a system from somebody else, because then you just have expectation from someone/something that you don't really know much about.

Hi all !
Just spent ages reading all the archive stuff here and almost bored now re Brimardon comments and decided I just dont have a view ! But please can someone explain - simply - how I find Ken's selections which seem well informed as as worth following as anything else. Thanks and hope things are going well with whoever reads this !
Rob

hi, im still here but not posted for a while as it gets very frustrating trying to say somethings good when 90% can go on hearsay and say its no good, i will just confirm what i have always said before, whether its brimardon, isiris, rix ect you will always get the ones who dont make it pay but very rare to hear from those who do well but that is the way racing works. if you are doing well on any system you keep it to yourself or you get knocked down by every tom dick and harry if you try to stick up for something just like has happened on this thread.
if you want me to give you advice then these are my rules i will not mention winners losers or profits and will not confirm the bets or selections so i cant be accused of pushing the service.
The update is im still with brimardon like many others who learn how to take the highs and lows, things have changed and its a easier system now, we can now only see the best races of the day about 2 to 5 a day seems to be the average nothing else is shown and they highlight those further by calling them pro bets that average 0-2 per day, they are now only giving us high strike rate races and quoting 40 to 70% success on these races which i can confirm is so far correct. These races are not normally the races i would pick myself but i expect that as im paying them to give me what i dont know myself.
The most improvement is the betting through the betfair api and the software can now place my named bets or lays for me, ideal when im not on the computer when shopping with the wife gets in the way.
They also now use weight of money on the ratings of selections when using betfair api to take in to account of late gambles and quoting 5% more winners than before just by using this method, that seems unique to them as i havent seen it elswhere.
i myself back a lot of named outsiders and make additional profits by laying back in running when they run well, not something they tell you to do but just a twist i use myself.
hope we can now go forward and as ive tried a lot of things over the years my knowledge may be of use to some.